Comments on: Pre-Release Review of Flare V5 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/ Paul Pehrson's technical writing blog Sat, 06 Mar 2010 03:42:17 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Ronit Goldstand http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-73339 Ronit Goldstand Sat, 25 Jul 2009 18:36:48 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-73339 Thanks Bee - I will definitely look into that!<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('73339','Ronit Goldstand'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('73339','Ronit Goldstand','Thanks Bee - I will definitely look into that!'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Thanks Bee – I will definitely look into that!
Reply – Quote
]]> By: Bee Hanson http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-73338 Bee Hanson Sat, 25 Jul 2009 01:17:53 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-73338 Since the posting of the first Reply over a month ago, a Flare press release regarding Microsoft's use of Flare with their Amalga software was published. Our company has an Israeli unit, and I too thought there was no RTL language support in Flare, but check this out: "Because Flare provides a command line compiler can handle right-to-left languages, such as Hebrew and Arabic, as well left-to-right Western and Asian languages," Gross explains, "that means we can simply send the original source content for localization. Once the translated content comes back, it becomes part of the project that we can have Flare build."<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('73338','Bee Hanson'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('73338','Bee Hanson','Since the posting of the first Reply over a month ago, a Flare press release regarding Microsoft\'s use of Flare with their Amalga software was published. Our company has an Israeli unit, and I too thought there was no RTL language support in Flare, but check this out:\r\n\r\n\"Because Flare provides a command line compiler can handle right-to-left languages, such as Hebrew and Arabic, as well left-to-right Western and Asian languages,\" Gross explains, \"that means we can simply send the original source content for localization. Once the translated content comes back, it becomes part of the project that we can have Flare build.\"'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Since the posting of the first Reply over a month ago, a Flare press release regarding Microsoft’s use of Flare with their Amalga software was published. Our company has an Israeli unit, and I too thought there was no RTL language support in Flare, but check this out:

“Because Flare provides a command line compiler can handle right-to-left languages, such as Hebrew and Arabic, as well left-to-right Western and Asian languages,” Gross explains, “that means we can simply send the original source content for localization. Once the translated content comes back, it becomes part of the project that we can have Flare build.”

Reply – Quote
]]> By: John E. Bunch II http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-73335 John E. Bunch II Wed, 22 Jul 2009 19:37:37 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-73335 Excellent review of Flare 5.0. I found it very helpful, and thanks for the link about the DITA relationship tables. I just upgraded to 5.0, like you - I remember when 3.0 used to shut down on me three our four times per day. It was so bad, in fact, that I used to hit the save button after every single update to any file or topic - just to be on the safe side. What a pain that was. Flare 4.0 got much better, so if 5.0 is even better still, I'll be looking forward to it. JBII end transmission...................///<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('73335','John E. Bunch II'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('73335','John E. Bunch II','Excellent review of Flare 5.0. I found it very helpful, and thanks for the link about the DITA relationship tables. I just upgraded to 5.0, like you - I remember when 3.0 used to shut down on me three our four times per day. It was so bad, in fact, that I used to hit the save button after every single update to any file or topic - just to be on the safe side. What a pain that was. Flare 4.0 got much better, so if 5.0 is even better still, I\'ll be looking forward to it.\r\n\r\nJBII\r\n\r\nend transmission...................\/\/\/'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Excellent review of Flare 5.0. I found it very helpful, and thanks for the link about the DITA relationship tables. I just upgraded to 5.0, like you – I remember when 3.0 used to shut down on me three our four times per day. It was so bad, in fact, that I used to hit the save button after every single update to any file or topic – just to be on the safe side. What a pain that was. Flare 4.0 got much better, so if 5.0 is even better still, I’ll be looking forward to it.

JBII

end transmission……………….///

Reply – Quote
]]> By: David Goldish http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-73326 David Goldish Tue, 14 Jul 2009 23:01:01 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-73326 Real improvement I'd like to see in the new version (I guess I should address this to the Flare folks) is the importing of Word docs into Flare. I've tried two different methods and each one is a pain to do a conversion. But I suppose that's due to code differences in Word and Flare. I would also like to see Flare improvement in the generation of map IDs. The current interface is cumbersome, and never changes in product upgrades. I'd also like to see DHTML features (or XML equivalent) in the product to produce special effects (such as headings spiraling in on the page, etc. RoboHelp was really fun in that respect.).<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('73326','David Goldish'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('73326','David Goldish','Real improvement I\'d like to see in the new version (I guess I should address this to the Flare folks) is the importing of Word docs into Flare. I\'ve tried two different methods and each one is a pain to do a conversion. But I suppose that\'s due to code differences in Word and Flare.\r\n\r\nI would also like to see Flare improvement in the generation of map IDs. The current interface is cumbersome, and never changes in product upgrades.\r\n\r\nI\'d also like to see DHTML features (or XML equivalent) in the product to produce special effects (such as headings spiraling in on the page, etc. RoboHelp was really fun in that respect.).'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Real improvement I’d like to see in the new version (I guess I should address this to the Flare folks) is the importing of Word docs into Flare. I’ve tried two different methods and each one is a pain to do a conversion. But I suppose that’s due to code differences in Word and Flare.

I would also like to see Flare improvement in the generation of map IDs. The current interface is cumbersome, and never changes in product upgrades.

I’d also like to see DHTML features (or XML equivalent) in the product to produce special effects (such as headings spiraling in on the page, etc. RoboHelp was really fun in that respect.).

Reply – Quote
]]> By: Steve Goodman http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-73000 Steve Goodman Thu, 18 Jun 2009 11:24:46 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-73000 <a href='#comment-72946' rel="nofollow">@paul</a> - I won't disagree with you about it being a good publishing tool until, or if, I ever test it. Unfortunately, I can't see it being a realistic tool for us if it is only a publishing solution, because we already have a publishing solution (though our PDF solution leaves much to be desired-might even say it's more of a PDF problem than solution).<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('73000','Steve Goodman'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('73000','Steve Goodman','<a href=\'#comment-72946\' rel=\"nofollow\">@paul<\/a> - I won\'t disagree with you about it being a good publishing tool until, or if, I ever test it. Unfortunately, I can\'t see it being a realistic tool for us if it is only a publishing solution, because we already have a publishing solution (though our PDF solution leaves much to be desired-might even say it\'s more of a PDF problem than solution).'); return false;">Quote</a></div> @paul – I won’t disagree with you about it being a good publishing tool until, or if, I ever test it. Unfortunately, I can’t see it being a realistic tool for us if it is only a publishing solution, because we already have a publishing solution (though our PDF solution leaves much to be desired-might even say it’s more of a PDF problem than solution).
Reply – Quote
]]> By: paul http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-72946 paul Wed, 17 Jun 2009 15:29:36 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-72946 <a href='#comment-72930' rel="nofollow">@Steve Goodman</a> - I would amend your comment slightly. As a DITA <b>publishing</b> tool, I think it <em>is</em> ready for prime time. If you have DITA content, you can use Flare as a multi-channel publishing tool without having to use the open tool kit, or without having to use your own transforms to get some type of output. However, MadCap's roadmap for Flare includes a future release where Flare becomes a DITA <b>authoring</b> tool. So if you expected Flare 5.0 to be a DITA authoring tool, then yes, it's not ready for prime time, but it wasn't intended to be. Flare 5.0 is simply a DITA publishing tool. Authoring will be coming in a later release.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('72946','paul'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('72946','paul','<a href=\'#comment-72930\' rel=\"nofollow\">@Steve Goodman<\/a> - I would amend your comment slightly. As a DITA <b>publishing<\/b> tool, I think it <em>is<\/em> ready for prime time. If you have DITA content, you can use Flare as a multi-channel publishing tool without having to use the open tool kit, or without having to use your own transforms to get some type of output. However, MadCap\'s roadmap for Flare includes a future release where Flare becomes a DITA <b>authoring<\/b> tool. \r\n\r\nSo if you expected Flare 5.0 to be a DITA authoring tool, then yes, it\'s not ready for prime time, but it wasn\'t intended to be. Flare 5.0 is simply a DITA publishing tool. Authoring will be coming in a later release.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> @Steve Goodman – I would amend your comment slightly. As a DITA publishing tool, I think it is ready for prime time. If you have DITA content, you can use Flare as a multi-channel publishing tool without having to use the open tool kit, or without having to use your own transforms to get some type of output. However, MadCap’s roadmap for Flare includes a future release where Flare becomes a DITA authoring tool.

So if you expected Flare 5.0 to be a DITA authoring tool, then yes, it’s not ready for prime time, but it wasn’t intended to be. Flare 5.0 is simply a DITA publishing tool. Authoring will be coming in a later release.

Reply – Quote
]]> By: Steve Goodman http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-72930 Steve Goodman Wed, 17 Jun 2009 07:45:58 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-72930 <a href='#comment-72884' rel="nofollow">@paul</a> - Hi Paul, Thanks for the details. That's really what I need to know. It sounds like as a DITA tool, it's still not quite ready for prime time, unfortunately.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('72930','Steve Goodman'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('72930','Steve Goodman','<a href=\'#comment-72884\' rel=\"nofollow\">@paul<\/a> - \r\nHi Paul,\r\n\r\nThanks for the details. That\'s really what I need to know. It sounds like as a DITA tool, it\'s still not quite ready for prime time, unfortunately.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> @paul –
Hi Paul,

Thanks for the details. That’s really what I need to know. It sounds like as a DITA tool, it’s still not quite ready for prime time, unfortunately.

Reply – Quote
]]> By: paul http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-72884 paul Tue, 16 Jun 2009 15:57:24 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-72884 Steve, I believe that with the current version of Flare the preferred DITA workflow is to take some DITA content, convert it to a Flare project, and work in the Flare project to make updates, publish your targets, etc. I think that a secondary workflow would be to continue authoring in DITA, and then just use Flare as a publishing engine. The DITA target solution is a way to get your current project out into an industry-recognized output format that you could then take to use in another tool, if necessary. However, reports from real DITA users suggest to me that the DITA that is created doesn't match the DITA spec. For example, if you had a [note] element in the DITA source, Flare converts that to a [p class=note] element. When you output to DITA, the resulting content is in the [p class=note] format rather than the [note] element. A future version of Flare will address this (I assume) because you will be able to author natively in DITA. An ancillary issue is that since in Flare 5.0 you are authoring in native Flare format, not DITA format, Flare doesn't have any way to enforce the DITA spec (requiring certain elements in a certain order). So when you create DITA output, it is well formed, but MAY not be valid. (I don't know for sure, since I am not a DITA user, so I haven't tested this.)<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('72884','paul'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('72884','paul','Steve, I believe that with the current version of Flare the preferred DITA workflow is to take some DITA content, convert it to a Flare project, and work in the Flare project to make updates, publish your targets, etc. I think that a secondary workflow would be to continue authoring in DITA, and then just use Flare as a publishing engine.\n\nThe DITA target solution is a way to get your current project out into an industry-recognized output format that you could then take to use in another tool, if necessary. However, reports from real DITA users suggest to me that the DITA that is created doesn\'t match the DITA spec. For example, if you had a [note] element in the DITA source, Flare converts that to a [p class=note] element. When you output to DITA, the resulting content is in the [p class=note] format rather than the [note] element.\n\nA future version of Flare will address this (I assume) because you will be able to author natively in DITA. \n\nAn ancillary issue is that since in Flare 5.0 you are authoring in native Flare format, not DITA format, Flare doesn\'t have any way to enforce the DITA spec (requiring certain elements in a certain order). So when you create DITA output, it is well formed, but MAY not be valid. (I don\'t know for sure, since I am not a DITA user, so I haven\'t tested this.)'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Steve, I believe that with the current version of Flare the preferred DITA workflow is to take some DITA content, convert it to a Flare project, and work in the Flare project to make updates, publish your targets, etc. I think that a secondary workflow would be to continue authoring in DITA, and then just use Flare as a publishing engine.

The DITA target solution is a way to get your current project out into an industry-recognized output format that you could then take to use in another tool, if necessary. However, reports from real DITA users suggest to me that the DITA that is created doesn’t match the DITA spec. For example, if you had a [note] element in the DITA source, Flare converts that to a [p class=note] element. When you output to DITA, the resulting content is in the [p class=note] format rather than the [note] element.

A future version of Flare will address this (I assume) because you will be able to author natively in DITA.

An ancillary issue is that since in Flare 5.0 you are authoring in native Flare format, not DITA format, Flare doesn’t have any way to enforce the DITA spec (requiring certain elements in a certain order). So when you create DITA output, it is well formed, but MAY not be valid. (I don’t know for sure, since I am not a DITA user, so I haven’t tested this.)

Reply – Quote
]]> By: paul http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-72883 paul Tue, 16 Jun 2009 15:51:27 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-72883 Steve, That would be a great feature. You should submit it to MadCap Support: http://bit.ly/b7qGW<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('72883','paul'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('72883','paul','Steve, That would be a great feature. You should submit it to MadCap Support: http:\/\/bit.ly\/b7qGW'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Steve, That would be a great feature. You should submit it to MadCap Support: http://bit.ly/b7qGW
Reply – Quote
]]> By: Steve Goodman http://blog.paulpehrson.com/2009/06/03/pre-release-review-of-flare-v5/comment-page-1/#comment-72871 Steve Goodman Tue, 16 Jun 2009 12:29:45 +0000 http://blog.paulpehrson.com/?p=707#comment-72871 <a href='#comment-72870' rel="nofollow">@Paul Griffiths</a> - Paul, thanks for your response I'm sorry I wasn't clear, what I meant about opening multiple files is not actually having them open, but the act of opening them. With Dreamweaver, for example, I can select a whole bunch of files, right-click and open them all in source view. Two clicks. With Flare, I have to right-click a file, move my mouse to select "Text Editor" and then click it. Two clicks and mouse motion. Imagine having to do that for twenty or thirty files. Admittedly, most people don't do this, but it is very annoying for me.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('72871','Steve Goodman'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('72871','Steve Goodman','<a href=\'#comment-72870\' rel=\"nofollow\">@Paul Griffiths<\/a> - \r\nPaul, thanks for your response I\'m sorry I wasn\'t clear, what I meant about opening multiple files is not actually having them open, but the act of opening them. With Dreamweaver, for example, I can select a whole bunch of files, right-click and open them all in source view. Two clicks. With Flare, I have to right-click a file, move my mouse to select \"Text Editor\" and then click it. Two clicks and mouse motion. Imagine having to do that for twenty or thirty files. Admittedly, most people don\'t do this, but it is very annoying for me.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> @Paul Griffiths –
Paul, thanks for your response I’m sorry I wasn’t clear, what I meant about opening multiple files is not actually having them open, but the act of opening them. With Dreamweaver, for example, I can select a whole bunch of files, right-click and open them all in source view. Two clicks. With Flare, I have to right-click a file, move my mouse to select “Text Editor” and then click it. Two clicks and mouse motion. Imagine having to do that for twenty or thirty files. Admittedly, most people don’t do this, but it is very annoying for me.
Reply – Quote
]]>